Hey forum-lurkers,
We have two fighters in our adventure league game at the local comic store. One is dual wielding melee weapons and the other is dual wielding crossbows.
I've seen the erratta regarding how the loading of hand crossbows is handled. That's all very clear.
However, I am unsure about how the damage should be calculated.
A dual wielding meleer needs the the dual-wielding fighting style and duel wielding feat to gain their modifier with offhand damage.
A hand crossbow build needs crossbow expert as a feat, but does not need the dual wielding fighting style to gain their dex modifier to damage?
So does that mean that the dual wielding hand crossbow expert build is overall better due to higher hit rate with the archery fighting style?
I guess it works like this.
Crossbow expert + archery fighting style:
+2 to hit
Dex to onhand and offhand damage.
Better range.
Other feat bonuses.
Dual wielding fighting style + dual wielding feat:
+1 ac
Dex or STR to onhand and offhand damage.
Can now use 1d8 non-light weapons
Other feat bonuses.
Now it's range and accuracy vs potential damage gain and +1 ac?
I'm just trying to understand how the feats and fighting styles benefit both of these players differently so I'm not calculating anything incorrectly.
Thanks in advance,
Dove.

One of the nice things about D&D 4e was that wizards and other spellcasters got to step back from the old routine from previous editions of relying on the crossbow during easy fights or after they expended their paltry assortment of spells at low levels. They had at least 2 powers they could use over and over again to do solid damage equivalent to a basic melee strike (often with very cool added bonuses).

Alas, in 5e the crossbow comes to the forefront again. A layperson may be forgiven for assuming that a low level wizard doesn’t really need a crossbow; after all, they have plenty of cantrips they can fall back on to do a wide variety of elemental damage. My response is that unless they are fighting monsters with vulnerability to fire, cold, or electricity, the crossbow is almost always a better bet until level 5.

Element vs raw dmg mhw

My reasoning is simple:

  • Damage: A wizard using point buy is often going to have a 14 or 16 Dexterity, depending on their race. With a 16 Dexterity, a wizard does 1d8+3 damage with a crossbow, blowing the 1d10 firebolt out of the water. That’s an average of 2 extra damage, which may not sound like much until you consider that it’s a 36% increase in damage that has less variance, making it much more likely to make the difference between an injury and a kill. Obviously, the effect is less potent for a 14 Dexterity Wizard, but 1 damage is still significant when the damage values are so low.
  • Spell Effects: Fire Bolt, Ray of Frost, and Shocking Grasp have relatively minor spell effects. In short, the effects of these spells are very situational. Fire Bolt is good for environmental effects, like setting an oil slick on fire or lighting a torch, but has no direct effect when used against a target. Ray of Frost has some use in the first round of combat or when an enemy if fleeing, interfering with their ability to approach and escape effectively, but its utility is limited during the bulk of combat when significant movement across the battlefield tends to become less important. Shocking Grasp is arguably the most useful, but it’s melee only; it’s really best as a way to do some damage and still withdraw (presumably to pull out your trusty crossbow). And of course, both Ray of Frost and Shocking Grasp only do 1d8 damage, which puts them even further behind the crossbow in the damage department.
  • Crossbow is better than ever!: The light crossbow has the loading quality, which is no surprise. What is surprising is that all the loading quality does is restrict you to one attack per action, bonus action, or reaction. Since wizards almost never get more than one attack per action, this tag is no real impediment. In contrast, in 3.5, a light crossbow required a move action to load, which could be a real pain.

I'm always sad to see Pathfinder rpg options taken out of the game, even if i understand not everything can be implemented, but i've always been a strong opponent to dex to damage, as it makes strength irrelevant, DEX already boosting your AC, your attack bonus on ranged, your initiative, a bunch of important skills, and reflex saves.

Find a way to increase your crossbow base damage up to 2d8 from 1d10 then vital strike away. Gravity Bow should do the trick. This is very feat intensive build. I suggest Fighter or Ranger with the Crossbow combat style. Good thing about fighters build is that you get +8 extra damage from weapon training and weapon specialization feats. Depends if you want pure monk or not. Those necks are not exactly rare and you can run through the 1st chapter with pretty much anything. If throwing weapons were not so rare it would be even easier. And if you are gonna dip for rogue it's better to start with it so you will have crossbow from lvl1 that will carry you to lvl3 where you'd get finesse training.

  1. I can't contribute any sources that aren't mentioned here, but I wanted to comment that I feel Dex to damage is a really unfortunate rule. Dex already gives a bonus to so many important stats that to include Dex to damage for say, a dervish dancer, it makes it stupid easy for characters to simply max their dexterity and call it a day.
  2. Swashbucklers Finesse (Swashbuckler 1) us Dex instead of Str for to hit with light or one-handed piercing melee weapon Dervish Finesse (Swashbuckler ACF Whirling Dervish 1) As Swashbucklers Finesse with scimitars.

In short, because crossbows add your ability bonus to damage, they tend to do a lot more damage than similar cantrips, which use a bare damage die. The cantrips, while situationally useful, just don’t pack enough of a punch to justify their use during the majority of combat. The same principle holds true for clerics, who would be well advised to steer clear of Sacred Flame (which only does 1d8 damage) and focus on a melee weapon (probably a mace) or a ranged weapon (hello again light crossbow), depending on their ability scores and preference.

Dex

Do Crossbows Get Dex To Dmg Pathfinder For Sale

Dex

All this becomes moot at 5th level, when cantrips do 2X damage dice and melee and ranged weapons see no change for Wizards. Of course, by that point, wizards have access to 9 1st-3rd level spells and the ability to refresh up to 3 levels of spells after a short rest once per day.

While I don’t think the damage-cantrips are useless (they have situational benefits), I would advocate steering clear of them at level 1 and then picking up your favorite damage-cantrip at level 5, when it has some more obvious benefits over the mighty light crossbow. Mage Hand, Minor Illusion, and Prestidigitation are all super fun, lending themselves to a wide variety of wacky uses, and it’s hard to imagine not wanting all three in your wheelhouse. Even the humble Light spell has more utility than most of damage-cantrips, but maybe that’s just because I don’t like keeping track of torches.

Do Crossbows Get Dex To Dmg Pathfinder Free

Do Crossbows Get Dex To Dmg Pathfinder 1

What do you think, dear readers? Do you agree with me that it is annoying to keep track of torches, or is that one of the things that makes D&D meaningful and fun?